[suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Ideas for cool stuff in the future.
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tangar
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[suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tangar » Mon Sep 10, 2018 7:23 pm

Post at my TomeNET blog

Devs just estabilished RPG-server and I’ve made test-stream there (in Russian) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmxsxnOjCWw

Impressions:

1) It’s awesome to have a chance to play without cheezing. Thanks to devs for giving such opportunity!

2) It’s ok to have separate RPG sever, but I still believe that having RPG-mode at main server would be fun :)
– you would see another players, their houses and feel that you are not alone in this magical worlds. Even with shared chat you feel yourself a bit lonely in Bree..
– there is a new map at RPG server. All this years I played at main server and I kinda love this places, there is my favorite forests and lakes… also I learned by heart location coordinates :) At new server everything is different.. Actually it could be fun to explore new server locations (cause Mathom House doesn’t got dungeons locations coordinates till players would open them), but to make it really fun TomeNET wilderness (openwolrd) should have more encounters and quests, it has to be enhanced.. So it would be cool to have new server layout in future, but not now.

But if creating new mode at main server is too hard (or it’s too hard to implement certain special Ironman-enhancements on dungeons and gameplay) – then it’s totally ok to play at separate server. And maybe it’s possible to ‘clone’ main server map to ironman-server?

3) In general Ironman server should to be redesigned imho.. Yep, right now it’s ‘IronMan server’, but it has to be ‘RPG server’ cause there is already IronMan mode (IDDC) at main server which is pretty good polished. Right now IronMan server feels too much like IDDC. When I go down to Barrow Downs – I wanna be able to come back, I don’t wanna be stuck in the dungeon till 1050 ft or deeper. Currently playing IronMan server got kinda almost the same feelings from the gameplay as I had at IDDCs. ‘Force-down’ approach should be changed.

So.. lets make some analysis of Ironman server (I would prefer to call it ‘RPG-server’ further) ruleset (8.6 in the guide):
-Only one character is allowed per account.
-All characters are no-ghost mode, so they have only 1 life (ie ‘unworldly’).
-Usually, accounts expire slower (183 days instead of 62 days).
-The Training Tower is empty, no monsters or items spawn in there (except for the Arena Monster Challenge event).
-Certain extra stores may spawn in the dungeons
(‘Seasoned Tradesman’, or specialized stores similar to town stores).
All above is good. Maybe even increase 2x chances to spawn extra stores in dungeons.. Anyway players wouldn’t have much gold to buy something from it, but it’s fun to meet such stores in the dungeon.
-All dungeons are ironman (see (4.3)):
-Bree’s dungeon ‘Barrow-Downs’ is normal ironman,
-other town dungeons allow recalling every 500 ft (10 floors),
-non-town dungeons allow random recalling at a 20% chance per floor,
-on dungeon levels shallower than level 20 (eg easier than -1000 ft Bree), recalling is impossible, overriding the above rules.
-Players may recall INTO dungeons to 50 ft + every 1000 ft, eg to 50 ft, 1050 ft, 2050 ft, … .
This is kinda too similar to IDDC ruleset..

On the one hand – force down dungeons are good to prevent players from cheezing – re-entering dungeon again and again to have ‘nice’ layout. But actually new characters won’t do it much, it’s useful tactics only for high lvl chars and it could be fixed this way. I like particular this idea:
…when you use stairs from the surface – after you appear in the dungeon, you do not have stairs under you (it’s like you used Word of Recall spell from the surface to -50 and appeared in random place). But stairs upwards exist on this lvl, if you wish to go back to the surface from that lvl you just have to find stairs
….it could be used at RPG-server to prevent cheezing and make game more hardcore than normal mode, but less IDDC-like. To make entrance stairs work like ‘pit’ – when you enter them you can’t go back, but could find a upper stair somewhere around. No cheezing and fun at exploration.

Back to concept:
1) The main GOAL of RPG-server imho: give player possibility to feel himself NEWBIE again, newbie every time. Like when you first time found artifact (even paurnen gloves), when you have to save your gold to enchance weapons and armour, when you play careful and have to survive from the 1st lvl. It’s THE BEST feelings which I had in TomeNET – when I just started to play and didn’t had anything. But making it impossible (or too hard) to return back from the dungeon to town – doesn’t bring ‘newbie’ gameplay. It’s just extra hard mode for people who like to dive avoiding towns and it’s already exist at regular server as IDDC mode.

2) RPG server should make everybody equal. No matter how much you played (or grinded) – you start new character from scratch everytime after you die. It’s a backbone of RPG server.

3) Motto of RPG server shoudl be: ‘No cheezing available’. It makes everyone equal and provide truly TomeNETish gameplay.

So instead of force_down concept, this is my vision – how to ensure RPG-server principles:
– make entrance stairs work like World of Recall spell (put you in random place in the dungeon), but make dungeons not force_down (some dungeons could be force_down, like Moria).
– I like the idea to restrict the use of World of Recall scrolls in certain way – to prevent scumming lvls for nice layout (EX: you enter lvl, if it’s bad – you recall and re-enter). But it’s important not to make recall-restrictions too harsh. Lets make it like this: all dungeons allow random recalling at a 50% chance per floor. So sometimes you could get away, sometimes not. Fair and square. Also make end-game dungeons 100% recallable (Angband), cause there is already too dangerous even at regular server.
– considering recalling _into_ the dungeons – it’s not really big problem, it doesn’t makes game easier to play, but just make it more comfortable. So this restriction could be lifted imho.

Yet Another problem appears if we would remove force_down dungeons – grinding low-lvl dungeons. EX: player lvl 42 could go again and again at Barrow Downs to kill weak monsters to get loot. To prevent it I suggest to use element of present IDDC mechanics with ‘stale’ lvls:
However, if you log off and wait until the level has reset, then the level will be “stale” for you, the next time you log on, which will prevent you from getting any experience, items or gold until you move on by taking a staircase to the next floor.
.. but at RPG-server it should be like this: prevent getting exp, items and gold if this lvl is ‘grey’ (if you don’t get experience from it). It would force players not to lurk at low lvls.
-Players start with more gold (class-dependant) to buy supplies.
-Players additionally start with a few cure wounds potions.
Remove extra gold. Add there stuff from IDDC, like some ID scrolls. Also would be good to add enhanced pseudo-ID system from IDDC:
As a little extra bonus, slot-exclusive IDDC characters will also randomly gain knowledge of some item flavours on entering the IDDC dungeon.
Also: remove sales from shops. It would make people actually play the game, not cheeze for items for sales in shops :)

Actually as players would die pretty often at RPG server I suggest also give all newborn characters:
1) 5 Phase Doors scrolls
2) Spade (it’s annoying to wait till it would appear in shop, sometimes it take for a while)
3) World of Recall scroll
4) Lantern and 3 oil

Remove from backpack:
1) guide book (every one destroy it anyway)
2) torches

It would save a lot of time to players and would make deaths more comfortable.
-Players get a message in chat when party members take a staircase.
-If a party owner dies, someone else from the party is automatically promoted to party owner, so parties won’t get disbanded easily, making party-diving more effective.
-Mimicry users have a very slim chance of insta-learning a form!
(Note that this also works ‘in advance’, ie while you have not yet the required mimicry skill to actually see the learn-message show up.)
This is ok, although mimicry buff is too imba imho, maybe make it a bit less effective than current IDDC.
-Item level restrictions are disabled and have no effect.
This should be removed, huuuuuge cheezing opportunity. Actually I think the best way to prevent cheezing (apart of forbidding trade between players completely) is this: make all items which player pickup – to have the same lvl reqs as player got. EX: if you take ‘simple’ longsword as 50 lvl character – this sword would have lvl 50 reqs. Make it to all items – potions, scrolls, etc. To prevent cheezing with gold – make gold not droppable (so the only way to buy items for gold – is to buy them from storage house).

One last ‘sneaky’ spot left – if one high lvl player would take another low lvl char with him to take loot which mobs dropped.. To prevent it – let’s make lvl ‘stale’ if low lvl character comes to it.. Or maybe make lvl reqs of dropped items equal to player who killed monster… We could think about other ways to go around this corners.
-Extermination orders can be acquired as early as at level 3 instead of level
5 and the amount of monsters that needs to be slain is even somewhat lower.
-Temporary luck bonus from deeds is somewhat longer.
-Usually, scheduled artifact resets happen less frequently (if at all).
OK.
-Halloween event allows players up to 40 instead of 35,
and the Great Pumpkin spawns on floors up to level 49 instead of 39.
I believe that all events should not take place at RPG server. Gameplay complexity has to be equal at holidays and normal days; as I wrote above – to make game equal for all players – it’s the goal of RPG server. Why players who play on holidays got advantage over players who play at regular days?
-Stealing from stores is possible right away instead of requiring a certain character level (usually 5 on normal servers).
Prevent stealing from shops completely. Stealing = grind = unfair advantage based on how much time you spend on it, but not at your playing skill.
-Server settings that would usually turn items dropped/thrown by very low level characters to level 0 will be ignored, ie item level is kept.
As I wrote above – lvl reqs for items has always be equal of their owner lvl… Or just turn off trade between players if other solutions are too complex. In TomeNET there are enough of player interactions without trading. Actually turning trade off would make people who play solo more equal to party players.
Tangar's guides, addons, mods & fonts: English TomeNET page ||||||| Russian TomeNet page
http://youtube.com/GlazGame — streams in English // http://youtube.com/StreamGuild — streams in Russian
My chars @ angband.oook.cz

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tangar
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Re: [suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tangar » Tue Sep 11, 2018 11:44 am

Open-World exploration

1) I tried to make some exploration in open-world, cause new server had all dungeons in random places. Actually it's pretty fun to make such explorations, it feels very like playing Dwarf Fortress (where new world procedurelly generated every time). Just imagine it: MULTIPLAYER Dwarf Fortress :D People from all over the internet would come to play something like this. Smart procedure generation of open-world - it's ingenious TomeNET feature.. Right now it's kinda underestimated and unknown by most of players, but it could become one of main features at RPG-server and should be advanced far beyond! :D

It could be pretty interesting to make server reset over time, to shaffle all open-world locations. Maybe even re-shuffle world every week (please don't throw stones at me yet, see below how to make it work properly). The open-world exploration could be regular activity!

2) To make exploration more interesting there could be added add more random encounters - monsters, pits with monsters..

The problem is: it's pretty easy to run away from monstes in open-world. You just go to another sector - and you are safe (a least if there is nothing dangerous at another sector hehe).

As it's quite impossible imho to make monster follow player to the next sector when player flee, we could do this:
- if player engaged in combat in open-world, 'bind' player for some time in current sector, so player can't leave this location immediatelly. Actually right now we got quite close mechanics, but in terms of running - when player not in combat he could run faster x5, when player see active monster - you move with retular speed. In open-world this mechanics would look a bit different: when you engaged in combat - you can't 'pass' sector line - and have to wait 30 seconds in combat; but if you kill enemy - then 'bind' would be released immideatelly and you could exit sectom right away.

Such mechanics would give wide possibilities to make open-world more real and interesting.

3) It would be neat if each sector would have lvl of danger, similar to one which I suggested for resource gathering some time ago

Image

EX:
sector area 1 - spawn <lvl 10 monsters
sector area 2 - spawn up to lvl 20 monsters
..
sector area 9 - spawn up to lvl 90 monsters (but make it rare).. yay!
& etc... and don't forget for OOD monsters too! :D

Also bind dungeon's locations to appropriate sectors when world generated. So to find 'Orc Cave' dungeon newbie players wouldn't need to go to sector 9 :D

4) Quests. Open-world at RPG server could be perfect 'sandbox' area for experiments with quests. At first, there could be simple random encounter-quests implemented - like you meet a caravan (or cart) which is under orcs attack. If you would save caravan master - he would reward you $.

And again - 'bind' quests to appropriate sectors (with very rare OOD quests, why not hehe).

5) To make it easier to find dungeons (it's quite hard atm), territory near them could be occupied by monsters themed to this dungeon, like this:

Image

Red dot - is sector with a dungeon, nearby has to be quite a lot of related monsters. Orange - sectors around dungeons sector - orc should be more common there, than other monsters; yellow - orcs could occasionally seen there.

6) Forbid bat-body characters at RPG-server (they too imba at <35 lvls and ruin open-world exploration)
Tangar's guides, addons, mods & fonts: English TomeNET page ||||||| Russian TomeNet page
http://youtube.com/GlazGame — streams in English // http://youtube.com/StreamGuild — streams in Russian
My chars @ angband.oook.cz

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tangar
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Re: [suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tangar » Fri Sep 28, 2018 4:30 pm

If there would be server reset system (every month?), yet another tiny additions:
1) add name of the person who was first to 'explore' dungeon location to Major house (in 'h' - exploration history). Then player would have additional motivation for exploration.
2) give players exploration points (or just reward tickets with luck bonus) for successful exploration of a dungeon.
Tangar's guides, addons, mods & fonts: English TomeNET page ||||||| Russian TomeNet page
http://youtube.com/GlazGame — streams in English // http://youtube.com/StreamGuild — streams in Russian
My chars @ angband.oook.cz

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tokariew
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Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 8:20 pm
Location: Poland

Re: [suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tokariew » Fri Sep 28, 2018 5:52 pm

1) you mean demotivation, i don't want my name to be displayed in some virtual reality… :twisted:

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tangar
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Re: [suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tangar » Sat Sep 29, 2018 1:25 pm

yet another troll post? :D you mess nickname and name. and if you play the game, your nickname already appear at https://www.tomenet.eu/mainstats.php https://www.tomenet.eu/deaths.php or at this forum (it's also virtual reality).
Tangar's guides, addons, mods & fonts: English TomeNET page ||||||| Russian TomeNet page
http://youtube.com/GlazGame — streams in English // http://youtube.com/StreamGuild — streams in Russian
My chars @ angband.oook.cz

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tangar
Posts: 1325
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Re: [suggestions] TomeNET RPG server remake

Post by tangar » Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:02 pm

Dear devs, please make it possible to play TomeNET with newbie-experience single-character mode. Today I've recognized - I'm not the only person who suffering from it (my suffering stream: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExW_yfkbZtY ) - there are more people who also tired to have loads of items at their main account, but they do not like IDDC-like RPG server where all dungeons are force-down.

Maybe come back to the idea of separate mode at main server? https://www.tomenet.eu/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1092

Please help to make TomeNET great again for people who wish to play 'ab ovo'! Please...
Tangar's guides, addons, mods & fonts: English TomeNET page ||||||| Russian TomeNet page
http://youtube.com/GlazGame — streams in English // http://youtube.com/StreamGuild — streams in Russian
My chars @ angband.oook.cz

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